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Old December 13th, 2009 #21
Bardamu
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Originally Posted by Alex Linder View Post
How is calling him a homosexual a malicious attack?

He has never denied it. I'm not known a liar. I've never called anyone a jew/homo/informant when it couldn't be backed up. You know Johnson. Do you dare to ask him straight up whether he is a queer?

Greg Johnson is in fact a homosexual. And it is certainly relevant to know that someone in an important WN position is a homosexual.
Lets say this accusation is born out by the facts. What then? What if people choose to overlook the fact because a man is brilliant, tireless, committed, and as dedicated as anyone on VNN. Hitler worked with not only known homosexuals but ones that slummed and a carried on publicly. Homosexuality is a fact of human existence. It has been around forever, and it will continue to be around. It is concievable that a person could be both homosexual and a great benefit to our cause. Would you turn away a homosexual billionaire if he offered to contribute to the cause?

Quote:
KM and TOQ and "Hunter Wallace" can write another 1000 essays, and that won't change. You can't change the culture except in very limited ways without controlling the government and the mass media. That means politics, and that means activism.
Your attack on writers is hilarious in light of the fact that you are a writer yourself, a kind of WN H.L. Mencken. You have all the usual literary pretensions, which is okay but ridiculous when you start criticizing the same qualities in others.

Can anyone here imagine our enemies attacking one another the way we attack one another? Ever read the Jews mount an attack on that homosexual Jew that has partial control of Disney? It is ludicrous the way we attack each other.
 
Old December 13th, 2009 #22
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I disagree with the claim that Bill White has "a genuine intellectual understanding of national-socialism." When I read what he had to say about it, what he was saying was more like Italian Fascism. White really doesn't like the racial idea, especially in regard to the Jews, which is one reason why I have always suspected that he was a Jew.

I happened to be working in the NA offices when Kevin Strom did the COINTELPRO broadcast and I told him at the time that I thought it was ridiculous. One problem that I had with it was that he was using a National Alliance broadcast to address an issue that was really entirely about him. I felt that this was completely inappropriate even apart from the fact that what he was saying was dubious.

I wonder to what extent White exacerbated that conflict between Strom and Linder.

Last edited by Hadding; December 13th, 2009 at 10:48 PM.
 
Old December 13th, 2009 #23
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Originally Posted by Alex Linder View Post
How is calling him a homosexual a malicious attack?
It is a personal attack, a low blow, a cheap shot. It is the verbal equivilant of a kick in the groin or an eye gouge.

Quote:
He has never denied it. I'm not known a liar. I've never called anyone a jew/homo/informant when it couldn't be backed up. You know Johnson. Do you dare to ask him straight up whether he is a queer?
Yes, I know Greg Johnson. We've met several times. We talk on the phone all the time. I don't know many people who are more valuable assets to the movement. I've heard you say that he wrote some of the best articles ever published by VNN. As for his sexuality, I have never asked him about the matter. Like your Chron's disease, I don't consider it relevant to the struggle we are engaged in.

Quote:
Greg Johnson is in fact a homosexual. And it is certainly relevant to know that someone in an important WN position is a homosexual.
If I am not in a position to know this, then I am certain you are not either. Even if it were true, it is nowhere near as much of a concern as the flaws of people like Bill White, Rounder, or Hal Turner, not to mention Todd in FL, the amateur bombmaker who used to post here.

Quote:
True. I was absolutely consistent in my attacks on Francis while he was alive and after he died. My attacks were completely correct, completely vindicated by all history. I have nothing to apologize for, and I will continue to attack the obese loser and any self-styled WN who makes excuses for him or encourage others down his cowardly path of failure. He is the poster boy for trying to have it both ways, and nothing you or anyone writes can change that fact. Sam Francis never called himself a WN in any public column, but he blamed WN for not backing him up when he was fired. That shows you his character.
There are substantial criticisms of Sam Francis to be made. He was too soft on the Jews. He was too critical of anti-Semites. He tried to keep a foot in both words, conservative and racialist. To a point, I agree with you.

The personal attacks on Francis - he was an obese homosexual loser - detract from your case. They create sympathy for Francis.

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Polished turd is the best possible term to describe Jared Taylor. It fits him exactly.
Taylor is the most courtly, regal person I know. He conducts himself as a gentleman. This is one of his greatest assets. He doesn't come across as a stereotypical racist. People who would instantly dismiss a Rounder or ANSWP Commander Bill White pay attention to Taylor when he speaks.

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Apparently you and TOQ and MacDonald are unable to separate your politics from your personal friendships. I am. I see exactly what PT is doing, and I will continue to call him what he is, and encourage others to reject him.
This is untrue. I believe Taylor is an asset. He is like a racialist high school teacher. He introduces implicit whites to the basics of racial consciousness. He's good at doing that and I support his work.

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Yes. Another way of putting it, as I advised in my long piece on Buchanan (here) is that the right way for us to go, who want what you call an ethnostate free of jews is to draw an indelible line between WN and conservatives. That means rejecting and treating as jew-liberals people like Jared Taylor and Pat Buchanan. You don't agree with this position, apparently.
I have a different standard. While I loathe conservatism, I see incrementalism as unavoidable. I define victory as pulling the national discourse on race and Jews in our direction. Taylor and Buchanan are gateways to White Nationalism.

They bring aspects of our message to a larger audience. I myself followed that path into the movement. How can I condemn Buchanan when it was one of his books that led me to White Nationalism?

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You, and many others, while saying you are not conservatives, have truck with them, and in practice write and seem to think as though we are all part of the same movement.
You're more of a conservative than I am. You know this, Alex.

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What I have been trying to get across, for years, is that we are not. Buchanan, Vdare, Jared Taylor, have nothing to do with our cause. They are our enemies, not our friends.
You have a lot of substantial criticisms of all of the above (Francis included). Once again, I agree with you to a point. Your conclusion, however, is vanguardist purism. It is myopic to believe that everyone can start out as radical as you are. To newbies, you sound like you are from Neptune.

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Are you sure?
Yes. I'm not the only one who had this reaction.

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Here are things I find dishonorable.

- Sam Francis refusing to call himself WN, but demanding WN support.
Granted, a fair point.

Quote:
- Greg Johnson refusing to admit he is a homosexual, nor to detail just what kind of a homo-network he is part of, or buliding inside TOQ.
I don't know of any homosexuals inside TOQ. Do you have any hard evidence of this?

Quote:
- Greg Johnson allowing his writer 'Edmund Connolly' to plagiarize my concept of loxism, while pretending he conceived the need for such a concept/term on his own.
Where did Edmund Connolly use the term?

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- Kevin MacDonald publicly praising public conservatives like Pat Buchanan who never even mention him, let alone praise him, while saying that people at VNN "aren't helping" when we come to his defense when he's under attack by the SPLC.
MacDonald probably has the same perspective I do: it is easier for us to reach and influence Buchanan's readers than other conservatives. Buchanan is a key player in popularizing our ideas on the far end of the conservative spectrium. He is a gateway to the mainstream. Buchanan and Taylor generally don't attack us. An enemy would return fire.

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Those are not honorable. They are the actions of men who are character conservatives. Yes, they criticize jews. Which is good and necessary. But it's not sufficient to change things. If they don't follow the correct line, which I have laid down, then I can hardly be blamed for blaming them.
As a practical matter, what would you have us do? How would you reach into the mainstream? How would you overcome the Neptune Effect?

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This idea we should go our own way, and not criticize others who might be on our side for the way they do things - in practice, that leads to problems.
Of course we should criticize others in the movement. I've criticized Brimelow, Taylor, Buchanan and Francis myself. The question is how we should go about doing it.

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And it's also self-refuting. When you or Johnson say VNN and I should go our own way and not worry about others, you're denying us our way. I criticize anyone who needs critism, on my side or not. That's our way.
I don't think anyone minds you making fair and reasonable criticisms of TOO/TOQ. That's not the issue.

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Who is on whose side? People who call themselves WN but fawn after Buchanan and Jared Taylor and jew Paul Gottfried are the ones acting dishonorably and, more than that, stupidly. They aren't Aryan in the least. They plagiarize and fawn after those with more money or public fame than they have. This is not WN. It is the conservatism you say you reject.
Addressing the Jewish Question, endorsing a White ethnostate, embracing White racial consciousness ... this is not conservatism by a long shot. On the other hand, calling for the abolition of all financial regulation and popular social programs, well, that sounds very much like conservatism to me.

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I've already answered this above. Here, my point is, why use an absolutely silly term like 'ethnostate' - it's as dumb and misconceived as 'ethnic genetic interests.'
We're trying to reach people who are scientifically literate, intelligent, and well educated. Unlike the man on the street, these people typically have money and influence.

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True. We don't need government, not even a Nazi government, once we get the racial situation cleaned up. My position echoes with a lot more people than your big-government leftist academic view in which evil corporations are the real problem. Not only that, but you're completely missing what is unfolding right in front of your eyes. We don't need these government regulatory bodies. No matter where you look they are creating or exacerbating problems.
I will save this for my upcoming plunge into conservatism/libertarianism. In the meantime, I will hold this up as an excellent example of what I call "discourse poisoning"; in this case, the penetration of libertarian memes into White Nationalism.

Quote:
If TOQ or Vdare were serious about changing culture, they would be developing a HS curriculum, not writing high-level academic essays that are a long trudge, even for the educated.
A HS curriculum is a good idea. It is a worthy project. Rusty Mason had expressed interest in doing it. You should speak with him.

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Brimelow isn't pro-White. Ask him. This is where you and I disagree most strongly. You think everyone out there who sort of agrees on some of the problems is on the same side. I think they are not. Brimelow is business to raise money. He is not a pro-White, and would never describe himself that way. He runs a government approved foundation and employs non-white writers, including jews.
I've seen Brimelow deny being a White Nationalist before. Again, there are substantial criticisms of Brimelow to be made, but they don't have to be teethered to the albatross of personal attacks or abusive language.
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Old December 14th, 2009 #24
Hunter Wallace
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Originally Posted by Alex Linder View Post
VNN is updated daily, thanks to Socrates, and I have put out far more ideas, and better ideas, than anybody else on the Net.
Socrates is nowhere near as talented a writer as you are. Your output has declined and the VNN frontpage has suffered. I've seen countless VNN readers complain of this.

Quote:
No one, by contrast, associates a single idea or expression with Brimelow - or anybody at Vdare. I haven't read that site in years, it's just there to draw money from the middle class, not to make change that helps Whites.
Could you shed some light on your falling out with Dietrich? I've heard some disturbing rumors flying around.

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Here's the truth about yourself, which you don't realize. Your value, which is great, lies in your knowledge of American racial history. That's where you are close to unique when it comes to 'net commentary.
Thank you. I've said before that your constant hammering away at the Jewish Question has influenced my development. For a long time, I was quite dismissive of you, but I eventually recognized there was much truth in what you were saying.

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On the rest of the stuff, you'll come around to my position, as you already have in many ways. Sometimes you are echoing me without even seeming to know it. I like your writing, and you. I get a little irritated at your straw man 'Single Jewish Cause,' but whatever, no big deal.
We agree on the most important issues. I take a lot of your themes, translate them into a different language, and reach a different audience. White people are divided along class and religious lines. In order to reach them, we need to broadcast our message on different wavelengths.

Quote:
In conclusion:

- direct, vicious, even vulgar personal and political attacks are the right way to go, and we'll continue that here
As should be obvious, I disagree on this point.

Quote:
- NOT crediting people, plagiarizing them, displaying a back-dog spirit of fawning after rich, successful conservatives, naming and citing them, but not naming and citing people on your own side - continues to be the wrong way to go, and TOQ and Johnson, and even MacDonald, should be ashamed of their actions in this regard
This is unfair. Greg Johnson has long admired your work. He tried to engage you, but you responded with personal attacks. There are lots of VNN graduates in the TOO/TOQ network.

Quote:
- altho personal attacks are good, specific claims should be backed by evidence. No one should be accused of being a jew, or a fed, unless there is evidence put out. Those who make false accusations should be and will continue to be shunned at VNN. I say our ethics are not lower than TOQs and the other jew-criticizing conservatives, they are higher. We have put out more and better ideas than they have, and our behavior has been stronger and purer.
This is a policy that has evolved over the yeras. I remember the days when VNN was a free for all.

Quote:
- it IS the time for more activism. The woman down in StL can't get the school board to release the video of her daughter being attacked by a nigger. KM and TOQ and "Hunter Wallace" can write another 1000 essays, and that won't change. You can't change the culture except in very limited ways without controlling the government and the mass media. That means politics, and that means activism.
Activism is fine. In parts of the country (ex. Mississippi or Alabama), it is doable. In other parts (ex. Vermont or Massachusetts), it is not. We should be realistic about this. Instead of wasting $30 million on a fruitless political campaign, as Ron Paul or Pat Buchanan have done, we should focus our efforts on trying to change the culture. Without a cultural foundation, political victories will be fleeting and won't produce any substantial change in public policy.
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Old December 14th, 2009 #25
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Originally Posted by Sean Gruber View Post
b. He's a crypto jew, infiltrating WN to blame White people for getting cancer instead of blaming the cancer.
This is what friedrich braun was referring to when he mentioned the hysterical anti-Semitism at VNN.
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Old December 14th, 2009 #26
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Since the forum opened there was IMO perhaps 50% defectives, jooos, and NKVD types, some with 10,000 posts of nothing b.s. and fighting with White Working men, who just left, or/and just never joined. I did not join at first because the scum POS's that were allowed to post day and night seven days a week!

Excellent men were disgusted enought to pack it in.


As for Charles A. Lindbergh, folding like a house of Cards after Dec. 7, 1941, so did the business men, Senator's and House Representative's that Knew FDR Was a POS criminal, and they were very much against helping the conpsiracy bastards front regime called the USSR IMO. Charles A Lindbergh, could do nothing, the GodFather had made his move with the Dec. 7, 1941 set up. Notice nary a Word of Pearl Harbor this year, all was quiet on the enemy alien regime media.

Douglas MacArthur knew the truth of all the b.s. of WW 1 and 11 I believe.

The general wanted to make Lindbergh a one star on his staff in the Pacific, but he refused as he did NOT want to hurt MacArthurs chances to become president in the future. Remember the enemy Aliens wanted to tri Lindbergh !

The Korean war was launched IMO to keep Douglas OUT of the Whore House in 1952 as it was known in the fall of 1949 that the general was going to resign and prepare for 1952 starting in 1950 and he would have won. Then I honestly believe a Major clean and arrests would have come about along with many deportations!

Douglas MacArthur let FDR have his way and left the Flip Islands FUBARED as Ordered.
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Last edited by America First; December 14th, 2009 at 12:35 AM.
 
Old December 14th, 2009 #27
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Cant wait to hear the Interview with Kevin MacDonald, should be really good.
Great guy, he really lays down the Jew bare in The Culture of Critique.
Even Alex Linder sounded rather excited.
 
Old December 14th, 2009 #28
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Originally Posted by H.T.R. View Post
Whatever works. Dryer climate. If the Missouri air is literally fucking killing him, he needs to get to the southwest.
No, it's not that, I was just expressing a preference. Now, when I was young, yes, it really did bother me. I would get sick within 24 hours of getting to my grandparents. But when I grew older, I stopped having the breathing problems I had as a kid. The problems I have now are not related to weather. I just prefer the west for its dryness, and hot weather to cold. Missouri is great six months out of the year. Even the humidity, at least up here, is overrated. The winter mostly sucks because it's drab. It's cold, but not as cold and snowy as Minnesota or Wisconsin, to be sure.

Quote:
I'm no Linder nut-hugger. I accidentally called him a catfish once.
That wasn't a compliment?

It's true, I have thick lips and a big nose. I'm largely of German peasant background. But a smart streak of peasant, and mixed with the worst sort of English, the moral-crusading Puritan type. Luckily my inner asshole is channeled in the right direction.
 
Old December 14th, 2009 #29
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Once again you're wrong, although you'll never admit it. I've liked Ride of the Valkyries since I first saw Apocalypse Now when I was in high school. And I wasn't a racialist at the time. Stop second-guessing my motives, Linder. You don't know me.

Oh, would I? Do you own a crystal ball, Linder? I happen to like Mendelssohn's music, and he was a Jew. I also think Joel and Ethan Coen have made some great films, and they're Jews. What do you have to say about that, smart guy?
Sure. Could be. But the creature I describe does exist, whether or not you are he.

I have to fight until people admit that it is legitimate not to like Ride of the Valkyries. Actually, I don't hate it in the way I hate some stuff, I just find it unremarkable and mildly irritating.
 
Old December 14th, 2009 #30
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Originally Posted by Bardamu View Post
Lets say this accusation is born out by the facts. What then? What if people choose to overlook the fact because a man is brilliant, tireless, committed, and as dedicated as anyone on VNN. Hitler worked with not only known homosexuals but ones that slummed and a carried on publicly. Homosexuality is a fact of human existence. It has been around forever, and it will continue to be around. It is concievable that a person could be both homosexual and a great benefit to our cause. Would you turn away a homosexual billionaire if he offered to contribute to the cause?
I have said he is brilliant. As far as I know, VNN published his first work, and perhaps his best work.

Having homos as leaders is considerably more problematic than having them as pseudonymous writers or donors.

Quote:
Your attack on writers is hilarious in light of the fact that you are a writer yourself, a kind of WN H.L. Mencken. You have all the usual literary pretensions, which is okay but ridiculous when you start criticizing the same qualities in others.

Can anyone here imagine our enemies attacking one another the way we attack one another? Ever read the Jews mount an attack on that homosexual Jew that has partial control of Disney? It is ludicrous the way we attack each other.
Nah, it doesn't matter, really. I could say Johnson is attacking me by allowing plagiarism rather than doing the Aryan thing and crediting me with the concept of loxism. And I hate that I even have to say that, because it sounds like I'm whining for credit when what I'm actually doing is expressing spitting disgust at conservative-fawning idea-thieves. It is low and unAryan in the extreme to plagiarize.

I will continue to chastize these implicit conservatives wherever I find them in the WN community. Heheheh, oh I will. If they can't meet or beat me, how they gonna handle the jews?

Of course I'm not against writing, I'm merely making the point that the cutting edge today, if it existed, wouldn't be writing but would be acting. Agitating and advocating in public.

We with the fundamental problem with things must be pushing the boundaries to create the change we seek, and writing essays isn't doing that. It's just more of the same. That's the sum of what I'm saying. That and don't steal others' ideas without crediting them, it is unAryan.
 
Old December 14th, 2009 #31
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Great job, Alex (and Jim). If Alex is still calling in to MacDonald, two suggestions:

(1) Here is MacDonald's approach:

Quote:
We are trying to raise the status of this sort of discourse, and this is inevitably a top-down sort of thing. Notice that Derbyshire is not concerned about what the average person thinks, but what the cultural establishment thinks.
Why should I care what John Derbyshire thinks?

(2) How does a sociobiologist view faggotry? Is it a "lifestyle" consistent with general trustworthiness, or total degeneracy? Are fags a group with their own interests that differ from the interests of normals? Does the universal condemnation of faggotry by religions and cultures throughout history suggest there's something adaptive in shunning fags?
 
Old December 14th, 2009 #32
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Originally Posted by Klaas Ebbe View Post
This is untrue. I believe Taylor is an asset. He is like a racialist high school teacher. He introduces implicit whites to the basics of racial consciousness.
Any white racial consciousness that includes the Jews is suicidal. Jim Crow, apartheid and white Australia were all strong forms of racial consciousness (far more racist than German NS), but they all included the Jews as white, and the Jews used their insider status to destroy them all.
 
Old December 14th, 2009 #33
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Originally Posted by Mike Parker View Post
Any white racial consciousness that includes the Jews is suicidal. Jim Crow, apartheid and white Australia were all strong forms of racial consciousness (far more racist than German NS), but they all included the Jews as white, and the Jews used their insider status to destroy them all.
American Renaissance is a newsletter. There is nothing that can be done to prevent Jews from reading it. They also read VNN and OD. You make it sound like Taylor is running an organization like the National Alliance.
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Old December 14th, 2009 #34
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Hey Alex, Fade said this about rectum-loving, defecate eating, corn-holing faggots:

" As for his sexuality, I have never asked him about the matter. I don't consider it relevant to the struggle we are engaged in." (unquote)

NOTE: I think we're wasting our time trying to make a real WN man outa him.
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Old December 14th, 2009 #35
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Originally Posted by Hadding View Post
I disagree with the claim that Bill White has "a genuine intellectual understanding of national-socialism." When I read what he had to say about it, what he was saying was more like Italian Fascism. White really doesn't like the racial idea, especially in regard to the Jews, which is one reason why I have always suspected that he was a Jew.
Did you read any copies of his magazine? He had a better understanding of it than pretty much anyone I've seen posting here. Not saying I agreed with him, as he bought into that Ebola, I mean Evulva, I mean Evola garbage. His mag was poorly edited, but the articles were quite good. I didn't subscribe to it either, he just comped me.

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I happened to be working in the NA offices when Kevin Strom did the COINTELPRO broadcast and I told him at the time that I thought it was ridiculous. One problem that I had with it was that he was using a National Alliance broadcast to address an issue that was really entirely about him. I felt that this was completely inappropriate even apart from the fact that what he was saying was dubious.
Yeah. His weenie-ish deceitfulness and backstabbing came back to bite him on the ass when his estranged wife came to VNN with seemingly plausible proof of his sexual interest in children. I would have had a harder time believing her evidence if I hadn't experienced his vindictive pussiness first-hand myself, more than once.

Quote:
I wonder to what extent White exacerbated that conflict between Strom and Linder.
He didn't, really. I already disliked Kevin for my own reasons, per above - ie, his actions, not because I inherently disliked him. He's one of those guys who is not really mentally equipped to handle criticism. He interprets anything outside his taste sphere with immorality or danger or threat to himself. I was never any of those to him. He has abilities I don't, and what I am and do was intended to mesh with his efforts, never to supplant him. But I think he did feel threatened.

BW was talking to Streed and then others about the future of the NA. I was never more than peripherally involved, and it didn't matter anyway once the board backed down from getting rid of Gliebe. All I ever tried to do was help NA, but once I became familiar with its cultic culture and the low caliber of too many of its top people, I lost interest. Unlike most of its critics, I blame Pierce for this more than anyone. I believe what Griffin says in "Fame" - that he knew and intended NA to fall apart after his demise.

Last edited by Alex Linder; December 14th, 2009 at 05:43 PM.
 
Old December 14th, 2009 #36
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Originally Posted by Rounder View Post
Hey Alex, Fade said this about rectum-loving, defecate eating, corn-holing faggots:

" As for his sexuality, I have never asked him about the matter. I don't consider it relevant to the struggle we are engaged in." (unquote)

NOTE: I think we're wasting our time trying to make a real WN man outa him.
Fade-Prozium-Hunter Wallace writes ably and daily, there is value to him and what he does. He is wrong about certain things, but, as he came around on jews, he will come around on the other stuff we VNNers are right on. They always do. Because they're Aryans, and they can only hold out against the truth for so long, and then it becomes undeniable. It will be the same with Johnson. I am not their enemy.

I will respond to Ebbe's many responses in this thread later, have been responding to posts at his site today.

http://www.occidentaldissent.com/200...#comment-27141
 
Old December 14th, 2009 #37
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Originally Posted by Alex Linder View Post
Did you read any copies of his magazine? He had a better understanding of it than pretty much anyone I've seen posting here. Not saying I agreed with him, as he bought into that Ebola, I mean Evulva, I mean Evola garbage.
That's precisely my point. Evola has nothing to do with N-S. I didn't see his magazine. I read his ideological declaration on Overthrow back around 2003 and I noticed that he danced around the question of race, especially in regard to Jews.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex Linder
Yeah. His weenie-ish deceitfulness and backstabbing came back to bite him on the ass when his estranged wife came to VNN with seemingly plausible proof of his sexual interest in children. I would have had a harder time believing her evidence if I hadn't experienced his vindictive pussiness first-hand myself, more than once.
I can't say that Kevin doesn't have character flaws -- I was quite annoyed with him for standing by Gliebe as long as he did -- but of the things that you mention, the one has nothing to do with the other. Whatever the content of his fantasy life may have been, he seemed to have it under control when I knew him.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex Linder
He didn't, really. I already disliked Kevin for my own reasons, per above - ie, his actions, not because I inherently disliked him. He's one of those guys who is not really mentally equipped to handle criticism. He interprets anything outside his taste sphere with immorality or danger or threat to himself. I was never any of those to him. He has abilities I don't, and what I am and do was intended to mesh with his efforts, never to supplant him. But I think he did feel threatened.
Yes, as irrational as that COINTELPRO broadcast was, I would say he was frantic.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex Linder
BW was talking to Streed and then others about the future of the NA. I was never more than peripherally involved, and it didn't matter anyway once the board backed down from getting rid of Gliebe. All I ever tried to do was help NA, but once I became familiar with its cultic culture and the low caliber of too many of its top people, I lost interest. Unlike most of its critics, I blame Pierce for this more than anyone. I believe what Griffin says in "Fame" - that he knew and intended NA to fall apart after his demise.
I was aware that Bill White was talking to Fred Streed. Fred thought he was a sincere convert to our worldview, but I have never been entirely convinced of that. Bill White is a good candidate for the Ideology of the Month Club, because he seems to have tried most of them. Was he ever really sincere about any of them, or is each one just a new vehicle for his attention-seeking?

What I recall hearing at the time is that you wanted to do media for the NA and Strom lobbied against this, evidently because he wanted to keep all the reins in his own hands. I personally didn't think it was good for Kevin to have that monopoly. Even the radio show, I thought, should be cut down to about 50% Kevin, because we had other people (e.g. Jerry Abbot and me) that could do some writing, and Kevin was clearly overloaded, to the point that a lot of his programs were sub par. It seemed to me that he could probably do a really good program about every other week. I knew that a lot of people didn't like his persona, a problem which obviously would have been meliorated if half the broadcasts featured other people.

I fully admit that there were problems with Kevin's performance but at the same time, he was also a great asset. He created that radio program, which more than anything else was responsible for the growth in NA membership.

The conflict between you and Kevin was a bad thing for the organization and our cause, and I frankly don't believe you when you say that Bill White's participation didn't exacerbate the situation. White's presence tended to increase the irreconcilability of both sides, on one side because you had an ally who was loving the drama and encouraging you to dig in your heels, and on the other side because you had aligned yourself with somebody so disreputable.

I see many things from that period, when everybody was disoriented after Dr. Pierce's death, that should have been done differently, and one of the most important is that a screwball like Bill White should not have been allowed to have any influence on the situation, and problems that were publicized on internet should have been settled privately.

If we'd had somebody with gravitas as chairman, I think these problems would have been solved. A good chairman might have said, Kevin, do what you can do well and let Linder do what he does well, and stay out of each other's way, and whatever you do, do not present your intra-organizational grievances to the general public. Without this kind of order imposed from the top, personality conflicts went completely out of control.

Last edited by Hadding; December 14th, 2009 at 08:37 PM.
 
Old December 15th, 2009 #38
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Originally Posted by Alex Linder View Post
Fade-Prozium-Hunter Wallace writes ably and daily, there is value to him and what he does. He is wrong about certain things, but, as he came around on jews, he will come around on the other stuff we VNNers are right on. They always do. Because they're Aryans, and they can only hold out against the truth for so long, and then it becomes undeniable. It will be the same with Johnson. I am not their enemy.

I will respond to Ebbe's many responses in this thread later, have been responding to posts at his site today.

http://www.occidentaldissent.com/200...#comment-27141
Yeah, I just spent 20-30 minutes reading posts on that thread. Lots of anti-VNN comments there. One even stated I'm a federal informant and that I've been paying all VNN's bills since 2004 with money provided by the federal government. Meaning, if true, that VNN is a FBI front group.

How bout it Fade ?? Do you think there's a chance it's true ??

As for Fade "coming around", good luck. You're not only gonna need good luck, but some divine intervention to boot. His head is harder than Krupp steele.

So Hadding used to live with and work with Dr Pierce, huh ?? I didn't know that. I wonder why he doesn't post under his real name.
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Last edited by Rounder; December 15th, 2009 at 05:09 AM.
 
Old December 15th, 2009 #39
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Originally Posted by Hunter Wallace View Post
American Renaissance is a newsletter. There is nothing that can be done to prevent Jews from reading it. They also read VNN and OD. You make it sound like Taylor is running an organization like the National Alliance.
Surely you jest. Is there nothing that AmRen can do to prevent Jews (including a rabbi) from speaking at AmRen conferences? Haven't they served kosher food in the past? Is there nothing Taylor can do to avoid the impression that "Jews look white" to him? You can't have it both ways, Hunter. If essays are important and ideas matter, then Jared Taylor's effort to include Jews in WN and his insistence we treat them as individuals are destructive.

Last edited by Mike Parker; December 15th, 2009 at 05:41 AM.
 
Old December 15th, 2009 #40
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If nothing else, this is a telling test of the TOQ approach. Hunter and the denizens of his blog are exactly the smart, educated, inquisitive audience TOQ’s essays are pitched at. Now Alex exposes a mentally ill sexual degenerate in a position of responsibility in the movement. Their reaction is to rush to the defense of the pervert and to snipe at Alex over some lack of propriety. It seems knowledge and intellectual understanding of some problems aren’t enough to overcome warped, maladaptive liberal values. If it’s important to reach this audience, it needs to be reached on a much deeper level.
 
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